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Weather Guy's 2ft Nano - 2 New Fish 6/2/2010

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Weather Guy's 2ft Nano - 2 New Fish 6/2/2010

Postby Xebadir » Sat 06 Jun, 2009 4:08 pm

Introduction:
So After much pestering, annoyance and general help from the MASOV community over my little pico, its time to upsize and run a decent size nano reef. The main reasons for the size of the tank are:
- I have limited space.
- I want a nano that is more stable and more trip friendly.
- I like the feel that owning a nano provides.
- Im moving to perth in round 2 years, and hence this tank will have a limited lifespan.

System Objectives: A much more stable system which is more conducive to keeping livestock, that still provides the challenges of a Nano, while allowing me the flexibility to have a lower maintenance schedule.

System Type: SPS and zoas plus some LPS.

Display System:

Strike up Date: 14/1/2009 (But is actually an upgrade of an established tank + additional LR from an established system with 0 out of water time, hence I do not reccomend following the additions I make, rather see my old 20L journal).

Display Tank: 2ft x 1ft x 1ft

Display Lighting: Hai-Yang 150W fan/Light Combo with 14,000K bulb. 10 Hour cycle 10am-8pm.

Stand: Wooden 2 footer stand

Hood: No hood planned as yet.

Sump: 26" long x 9.5" wide x 10" high, seperated with baffled section to eq and return, opposite end for fuge and DSB.

Refugium: Part of sump, Coral Rubble and LR with Caulepera Brachypus, and seperate parallel DSB, these are seperated at one end of the tank and trickle into the return, opposite to the equipment/media end.

Refugium Lighting: 20W Lamp from bunnings with Cool Daylight globe running on a 14 on / 10 off cycle starting 3 hours before and going for 4 hours after the MH cycle.


Support systems:

System Water: ASW

Display Water circulation: Vortech MP20 plus sump return for a turnover of around 100x.

Return Pump:2000LPH JHQ

Skimmer: Deltec MCE300 hanging off display

Evaporation Top Up: Manual


Chemical Support:

Calcium Addition: aragamilk dosing

Alkilinity Addition: aragamilk dosing

Other Chemical Maintenance: aragamilk dosing

Current Water Chemistry:
Nitrates: 4 ppm
Phosphates: 0.11 ppm
Alkalinity: 8.5 dKH
Calcium: 410ppm
Salinity / Specific Gravity: 1.025
Magnesuim: Not measured at this stage

Stocking:
Fish:
Assessor macneilli
Oxycirrhites typus

Inverts:
Tridacna maxima
Trochus sp.
Turbinastrea sp.

Corals
Acropora sarmentosa
Acropora dallas
Montipora sp.
Acropora sp.

Images:
Image

Hope people enjoy the trials and tribulations.[/i]
Last edited by Xebadir on Tue 09 Feb, 2010 12:18 pm, edited 16 times in total.
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Postby Xebadir » Sat 06 Jun, 2009 4:17 pm

Rightio, so now ive got the blurb outta the way, here is what is going on with the new tank preparations:

Lighting: Purchased 2x 70W

MH modified shopfitters with AMD 14k bulbs.

Skimmer: Purchased. Near new Deltec MCE300

RO unit: Purchased with new cartridges, Polyspun 1 micron and a Matrikx+5 Coconut from PSI

Powerheads:
Tunze 6025 - Purchased, basically new
Second Powerhead - Looking around to buy, any one of a Koralia 2 or 3, Vortech MP20 or another Tunze.

Return Pump:
Still deciding on size, suggestions appreciated.

Heater: Purchased- 100W main with a 75W backup.

Weir: Unsure of size needed, will need to fit 2 15 mm bulkheads probably at least 12cm wide by 10 deep.

Return Plumbing:
Locline 2 split 1/2 fitting.

Plumbing:
Will list once I pick up from Kirsty's. 15mm Bulkheads and piping. Will be using a syphon system with backup bulkhead.

Planned Sump:
Need to Purchase...anyone know any good sump builders? Current intention is to use a split inflow into the sump, with ball valve regulated flow into refugium at one end, other end into skimmer/ heater/ LR section, baffled through to return pump in centre.

So planning and organising is well under way.
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Postby Xebadir » Thu 11 Jun, 2009 1:45 pm

Had a little brainwave to measure up my shell-dweller tank today, going to do so when I get home, as I think it might fit well in the space under my tank...i may have a sump already without even realising it. To further complexifly the issue if I did make this change the result would be:

Malawi cichlids gone from all tanks, sydontis retained with shell dwellers (as they are tanganikans anyway).
Shell dwellers in my second 2 footer.
Shell dweller tank becomes sump or is got rid of. This hopefully will reduce my power load and make the room a little less cluttered.

Hopefully when I get home i will find the measurements to be nice (and though a bit small than I originally intended, enough to high the relevant stuff away), and then I can see if the new skimmer fits (it hopefully arrived today).

If anyone has a tank near the above specifications (24x9.5x10) id love to hear from you, mind you spoke to boronia aquarium and they would only hit me probably $50 to have a custom sump built at the required size..so maybe i should stop being such a cheap bastard and just do a measure specification and be done with it. Anyone able to tell me what I use to do the pretty sump diagrams that everyone seems to have?
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Postby SLACkra » Thu 11 Jun, 2009 3:15 pm

you can always use paint.exe, just have a side on and bird eye view diagram. Not exactly pretty but it works just fine.

The tank I'm going to use as a sump is about 45x20x20cm and cost me around $35. Came with a cover glass bit too which you could easily have a glass shop cut into bits you can use as baffles or whatever. Got it from water world aquarium. They're fairly close to you.

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Postby KirTracid » Thu 11 Jun, 2009 6:47 pm

If you're looking at pretty, sketchup is the one, you're looking at functional, I just use paint =)

Made any decision as of yet?
-Kirsty

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Postby Xebadir » Thu 11 Jun, 2009 10:11 pm

Going to have to have one built. The current one cant possibly fit. So im pretty sure im going to go custom as specified above.

Skimmer arrived today, as did the tunze.
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Postby Xebadir » Thu 11 Jun, 2009 11:51 pm

Ok heres my sump design, apologies im not very good with a touchpad and paint.

Image

Note that the panel height for the refugium/DSB section should be 11 inches to factor in the gaps as described below for an operational height of 10inches water depth.

Values are rough for the pump section, 1400LPH from ageofaquariums is 65mm wide, while the 2000LPH version is 105mm wide. Current specs in the diagram are for the 1400LPH with clearance. (2000 is 153x105x135mm as compared to the 1400 at 138x65x145mm)

If I went for the bigger pump id need to drop the fuge size. To explain the weird flow pattern for the DSB, , im thinking in that panel to have a combed 1 inch deep by say 3.5inches wide gap on 11 inch high panes (so effective height will be 10) to maximise the flow surface over the DSB, with the other side having an identical flow into the pump chamber, with the maximum height of 10inches just in case of overflow....just using it this way I think it better uses the 27 square inch surface area. For the baffles the underflow area would be one inch.

The 12 inch high sump will fit easily with enough plumbing clearance, and this allows me an emergency volume of 7.5L in case of power failure. (Which should easily encompass the 15mm return pipe, 15mm syphon and remaining volume in the as yet undecided weir). I was also throwing around the idea of having the inflow drilled through the tank side for convience, but im not sure on this as of yet...i could probably just flexi-pipe into the silent chamber. Was also throwing around the idea of a 26 inch sump given that im getting it custom made. I can fit it and it will make use of the maximum room length wise. This would give me another 2 inches to play with and maybe use to increase the size of return pump, but im open to suggestion.

Current sump volume at operation would be roughly: 38L, though probably 45L if I go the 26inch option. This means the system when operating is around 110L.

What do people think of this design? What are opinions on the pump size? Any variations or suggestions? When i get this built what size panels do I ask for to make the baffles and section seperators? Can anybody make suggestions on weir size?
Last edited by Xebadir on Fri 12 Jun, 2009 10:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby SLACkra » Fri 12 Jun, 2009 1:14 am

I'd say your design is fine. As far as weir size goes it really depends on what your going to be fitting into it. With my external overflow box I've ordered glass to construct it with an internal volume of 200(long), 150(tall) and 100mm(wide). This easily accomodates the two 25mm bulkheads i'll be having(syphon and durso) which have flanges that are 74mm in diameter. So basically you need to design your weir around the plumbing you plan on having in it. I also made mine slightly larger to make it easier to work with, 100mm wide means i should be able to easily fit my hand in it to fish things out or to clean off the intake filters of the syphon/durso.

Are you going with an intank weir or an external overflow? Seeing your sump design has made me think of changing mine to incorporate a refugium area where my skimmer and heaters will also be placed.

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Postby Xebadir » Fri 12 Jun, 2009 1:42 am

Not really sure which way to go. From a surface skimming perspective intank weir is definitely the go, and its probably safer with regards to the silent syphon/backup system. The external is attractive though as it wont tank up valuable tank space. I was also throwing around the idea of a FL corner weir as I dont think it would be that hard to do in the tank, with the stand being perfect. Im planning on buying my two-three 15mm bulkheads from bunnings this weekend so I can measure the flanges and get all the glass at the same time when I order the sump.

My main reason for the split end refugium/heater skimmer end is to allow me to regulate flow into the refugium at a much lower rate by splitting my syphon with a T junction, and regulating with an additional ball valve. If Ive got my fluid dynamics right this should mean the exposure time over the refugium and the DSB should be much higher than it would be as an inline system. The DSB is a modification of just having it flow directly accross that I like the concept of, allowing greater use of surface area.

Im started to get excited about how the tank design is coming together, and now that ive got the nice components im looking forward to doing more.

If any of the MASOV people or just general readers are looking to get rid of a cheapy 1.5-3k powerhead (or an expensive one) id be interested in buying it off you (to use until I get my MP20 muhahaha.) Also if anyone has a pump in the 1400LPH to around 2000LPH that doesnt sound like a greek wedding in progress that they like to offload id also be interested in making a purchase.
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Postby SLACkra » Fri 12 Jun, 2009 11:24 am

Sorry I think I was unclear about what i meant by an external overflow box. its basically a weir, outside the tank. Water overflows from the main tank into the external weir where there in my case will be a 25mm syphon(overkill) and a 25mm durso. In terms of sump flow I alsp plan on having a T intersection to send some of the syphon flow right back to where the pump is just to give me more flow control within the sump.

In regards to purchasing bulkheads, don't go to bunnings. I got my two 25mm bulkheads from a local pool/plumbing/irrigation place (Pumpworks) which is near eltham bunnings. I think they cost me just over $7 each. Convieniently the place I'm getting my glass from (Banyule Glass) is right nex to them. I'll probably also be getting most of my pvc fittings off them. They know their stuff and though i have yet to check their pvc fitting prices against bunnings' prices I'd say they're cheaper.

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Postby Xebadir » Fri 12 Jun, 2009 12:05 pm

Ahh thanks mate, given im only just down from eltham bunnings and its my local shop ill have a look at those other two places. Cheers ;).
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Postby SLACkra » Fri 12 Jun, 2009 12:11 pm

NP, Gary at the glass place is very helpful. Though don't bother him too much today he's supposed to be cutting my glass :roflmao: . There are two pool type shops though make sure you go to the one on the left. The bulkheads are on left hand side of the first row of shelves that are also on your left.

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Postby Xebadir » Fri 12 Jun, 2009 12:26 pm

Heh No chance of doing that today Andrew, 12 hour punishment again trying to get this journal paper off the list.
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Postby SLACkra » Fri 12 Jun, 2009 12:27 pm

Also Have you also considered possibly having the dsb and the refugium in the same area? I'm currently considering it. Though personally not sure whether i'll have a dsb at all might just have a large refugium with bits of live rock rubble and macro algae. I've been watching the two types of macro growing in my 4fter atm and they seem to enjoy high flow (particularly one species)which makes me think having a dsb and refugium seperate might be a good idea.

Also when you get your dsb setup i'll have to give you some of my sand. I've got this interesting little species of feather duster thats pretty much taken over parts of my dsb. particularly under the LR where they nearly form a mat!

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Postby Xebadir » Fri 12 Jun, 2009 1:18 pm

That sand sounds great ;).

I have considered having the DSB and the refugium in the same area but from all the stuff Ive read it seems to me that this is a compeditive situation with both areas looking for nutrients and this is sort of counterproductive, hence why im thinking seperated.

Another idea I had was to run 2 inputs at that end, with a long thin DSB (say 3"x12") with a very low input rate, and a thinner refugium thats longer (6.5" by 12") with a slightly higher rate, and then both regions going into the return. Not sure if this sort of idea would work though.
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Postby KirTracid » Fri 12 Jun, 2009 5:05 pm

Looks good =) Always best to seperate dsb and fuge due, but the dsb works almost as well together. It's mainly a space thing for most people.
Seems like a good design though, and standard designs always work =)
Ya want your plumbing anytime soon, or do ya want me to turn it anto another frag rack? :devil: :roflmao:
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Postby Xebadir » Fri 12 Jun, 2009 5:31 pm

Eeep...ill come get it. Sorry was a bit worn out when I got home at 9pm last night...was at uni from 6am yesterday.
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Postby Xebadir » Wed 17 Jun, 2009 5:52 pm

Well ive got my plumbing off Kirsty, Still working on getting a return pump and a second powerhead. The sump tank has now been ordered from Ernie at reeflections ;) at 26"x9.5"x12". It should be ready next week.
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Postby Xebadir » Thu 18 Jun, 2009 11:42 pm

Have also thought about lighting a bit, and am thinking that when I get my hood setup (A rusty style one) done I might look into a bit of DIY T5 action, as I know I can fit the T5s on either side of the MH fittings. Probably using something simple like:
http://www.aquariumproducts.com.au/cata ... 8&catID=86
Or another easily available ballast which I can fit up. Not sure if id be able to fit 4 individual reflectors in there... But id like to. If I did I would have 2 outlying actinics, 2 10ks or fiji purps or something like that.

Anyway, will enjoy my time in Perth before collecting my sump next week.
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Postby Xebadir » Thu 25 Jun, 2009 6:11 pm

Rightio, called them up today and ordered my glass, should be ready on sat morning. Gonna cost me a whole 31$ lol. Didnt have too much trouble with the dimensions, though for a maths major seemed to struggle with the cm --> mm conversion.
NB. Forgot to order glass for my weir...duh.
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Postby KirTracid » Thu 25 Jun, 2009 6:32 pm

Sounds like it's getting underway =) Good work
-Kirsty

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Postby Xebadir » Fri 26 Jun, 2009 11:28 pm

Rightio, all the glass is sorted, going to pickup in the morning. That means I should be siliconing tomorrow night (the sump that is...i think im gonna have to be nice to someone to drill my tank as I dont have the balls). Also I have know idea how bigger hole i need, far as I can tell, my flange is 64mm, and the threaded pipe is 20-21mm accross, so my best guess is a hole about 24-26mm ? Weir dimensions will be 285mm high (so full height) by long 150mm by 85mm wide in the LH corner of my tank (im reversing the sump direction so i can cabinet off the end closest to my bed.) I was a little conservative on the size to make it easy to work with. Picked up some additional plumbing today as well, ive now realise how complex my plumbing will be and its a little scary...mainly because of my rather odd design. Going to pick up the remaining plumbing and some PVC in the morning when I collect the glass. Basically to illustrate the complexity, im using:
In the weir:
Reducer fem thread to slip 15 to 20mm
Standpipe
Threaded T 20mm, endcap, 90 elbow 20mm.
short pipe, strainer cap.
Downflow section
2x Bulkhead 15mm
3x Threaded ball valve 15mm
1x Slip ball valve 15mm
Around 10 45 elbows for 15mm
1x 90 elbow for the DSB in.
2x 15mm union
6x slip to thread in 15mm PVC and about the same in thread to slip. Mainly due to a mistake I made.
1x thread to thread joint 15mm
2T joints 15 mm
roughly a metre of 15mm and a metre or so of 20mm PVC
.Return
a number of 45 elbows for the return at 20mm
1x 20mm union
1x threaded ball valve 20mm for return
1x 20mm fem thread to slip joint

So complex as all buggery for such a small system lol. Will be fun assembling it all I expect.
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Postby Xebadir » Sat 27 Jun, 2009 1:22 pm

Rightio got the stuff. Gonna work on the silicone tonight for the sump section, and am contemplating getting my glass supplier to drill appropriate holes for the bulkheads.
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Postby KirTracid » Sat 27 Jun, 2009 1:42 pm

Go Johnny! Good job. I'd suggest buying holesaws off ebay so you've always got em. I'll show ya how easy it is and you'll be wondering what you were worried about. Bunnings will probably have one. Just match one up slightly bigger than the thread on your bulkhead.
Like I said, I don't mind giving ya a hand, but I need the correct tools. My smallest fits a 25mm bulkhead snugly, but could do a 20. I'd be worried a 15 would be pushing it. We could fill the excess up with silicone, and it theory it should work fine, I've done it once reducing 1 hole size, but not two. Trust me, it's one of the easiest things you'll do, it just sounds scary. Only reason I got the balls to do it was after I drilled an "acrylic" tank, which was actually 3mm glass (realised after I started) showed me how surprisingly easy it was, so I started drilling all of them myself.
I got my last tank drilled at the shop, and he cracked the edge of the hole. grrrrrrrrrr. So never again. I find you take more care when it's your own tank.
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Postby Xebadir » Sat 27 Jun, 2009 1:47 pm

Mmm i might have a look then. When I bring your parts round (let me know when you want em) ill bring you the bulkhead so you can have a look at the size reqd so I can go buy one. At some stage today I need to motivate myself to shut the tank down for the cichlids and empty and clean it.
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Postby KirTracid » Sat 27 Jun, 2009 1:55 pm

haha, that should be easy compared to the amount of big reefs I've been forced to pull down. Lazy boy :poke: :roflmao:
Sometime later this arvo would be good, maybe 5 or 6, as I need to play taxi driver at some stage (ie. whenever Matt says so) then we'll have a look.
It wouldda been ideal to do an external overflow, but maybe a bit too risky for both of us being first timers. Personally, I'd only get an external done profressionally. It would look good, but noone will touch an already made tank. Even I'd be a bit scared to cut the slit out, that's why I never pushed that idea, mum wouldn't be happy with saltwater on her floor. haha
Sounds like it's coming along well. Didja end up getting your locline? I didn't. Grrrrrrr, which I'm really pissed about considering you ordered last and I actually need it now. Oh well, I can work around it.
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Postby Xebadir » Sat 27 Jun, 2009 2:02 pm

Hah, its more making sure that when he gets in the other tank for holding that he doesnt kill all the other fish. The locline didnt arrive so dont despair. I wouldve loved to do an external so as not to loose space, but yeah, way to scary, and from what slackra was saying probably best left alone lol. Doesnt matter anyway, happy with what ive got. Now just need to secure the vinyl for the back of the tank. Probably will need to be later than that as im off to a movie at 5pm.
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Postby KirTracid » Sat 27 Jun, 2009 2:09 pm

Externals are awesome, but I'd want it falling on the tank builder if something goes wrong personally. hehe
Later can be cool, Hendrik will be over at around 8 pm, so I'll be around then too. Just give me a call first as I haven't bothered to buy credit (I've been using the interet to sms you)
With the vinyl. You spray water and a tiny bit of detergent on the back. Put it on and then smooth it out slowly, like a sheet of contact, pushing out all the air bubbles. If you get some at the end (hopefully you won't as it's only a small piece) you push out the air with a pin. You can move it around a bit whilst it's wet too. Drill holes first if you want em on the back, don't worry if you're doing em through the bottom. Far easier as it's slippery.
-Kirsty

My new 10x3.5x2 SPS dominated mixed reef ( start date: Christmas time)
My 5x2x2 SPS dominated, ATI LED Powered ZEOvit Reef - basically discountinued
Where clams & Angelfish can live in Harmony :)
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Postby Xebadir » Sat 27 Jun, 2009 11:11 pm

Alright,
Sump is now siliconed to all buggery, its not very pretty but Im not really into the whole pretty thing....ill prolly do a little cleanup tommorow or something. Im happy with how the design turned out,it should be interesting. Little light headed from all the acetic curing fumes, but hopefully will get over it shortly. Picked up the return pump from Kirsty and had a chat about bulkheads, looks like im gonna be making a trip to bunnings to find me an appropriate sized one to minimise the required silicone work reqd, and Ill have a go at doing it (scary lol). Might do some work on the plumbing assembly tommorow, though im a bit hazard to do some stuff until I get the bulkheads and weir done to check for exact fit. Aim is to have it wet next weekend. Will post a pic of my sump when im a little less embarassed by the amount of silicone.
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Postby Xebadir » Mon 29 Jun, 2009 4:40 pm

Have decided to drop back my return line to a 15mm, as everything else in the return system (including the pump and locline) is that size. Hence back to the plumbing shop in the morning to return the parts and exchange them for the smaller fitting. Pretty happy with the silicone in the sump...even if it is a bit messy. Purchased my sand from AoA today so hopefully that will arrive later in the week, as well as my salt for ASW (ive decided that im going to at least have it for emergencies and when I cant make it the hour or more return to the LFS, if not use it to control things a little more).
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